Haku was a GIRL, not a boy!

What do you think Haku's true gender is having read the first post?

Female
35
26%
Male
98
74%
 
Total votes: 133

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Re: Haku was a GIRL, not a boy!

Post by hvk »

I believe Haku was a boy, even after reading all of your information. While I understand where you're coming from rather well actually, I just don't think Kishimoto would be that deceptively brilliant, when the rest of the series is so simply straight forward, no offense meant but it sounded like you were reading too far into it to find facts that detectives would miss in what you've claimed to be a kids show. That is all.
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Re: Haku was a GIRL, not a boy!

Post by spike383 »

well, seriously. the creator of naruto itself wrote it in the manga. haku, gender = male. makes no sense he would be lying. there happen to be alot "transgender" characters in japanese animes/games like Poison in (Final Fight) and others. also maybe some of you younger ppl heard of it. specialy in japan parents used to raise their sons as girls,that was done to keep them from joining the army a few hundred years ago. they did dress themself and live as a girl. haku himself says hes a boy, kakashi is no idiot he did notice it too. ^^ about the flashback; calling a small boy or a girl about the age of 10+ kid doesnt tell anything about its sex. its no use to debat this, haku is a boy. i think some kids just fell in love with him and wont accept that ^^

voted: boy
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Re: Haku was a GIRL, not a boy!

Post by Syntos »

I am not reading ALL of that.

My opinion on the issue:

Haku is a boy, he says it clearly to Naruto in the forest that one day. Also, back on the 'decieve' issue. He may have told Naruto that, not knowing that he would have to fight him later on. So he may as well let Naruto have the smug beleif that he had met some random kid, picking herbs in the forest
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Re: Haku was a GIRL, not a boy!

Post by Seiji Sawamura »

Haku is a boy. no matter what you say. Interview with the creator a logn time ago asking if haku was a girl. he said. "He looks like one huh? no haku isn't a girl he is a boy." more discription here.

Haku (白 ?) is Zabuza Momochi's right hand man and most faithful follower. He has a heavily androgynous appearance, so much so that when Naruto Uzumaki first meets Haku he ends up mistaking him for a girl, saying that "he's prettier than Sakura!".[115] Before he started working for Zabuza, Haku lived as an orphan. His father killed his mother when it was discovered that she possessed a genetic ability, and his father would have done the same to Haku if Haku had not killed his father first. After wandering from place to place for a time he was found by Zabuza, who recognized Haku's talents and agreed to take him in as a tool. As a result, Haku becomes unquestioningly protective of and loyal to Zabuza, and only by being useful does he find a purpose in life.[116] He ultimately gives his life in his mission to be useful to Zabuza, becoming a human shield to protect his master from Kakashi Hatake's Lightning Blade.[111] Haku's genetic inheritance, Hyōton (氷遁 ?, lit. "Ice Release"), allows him to mix wind and water elements to create ice. He commonly uses this ability to surround an enemy with ice mirrors that he can freely merge with and instantly move between. He then bombards them with needles, and with his superb accuracy he can hit pressure points to put opponents in a death-like state. This reflects his pacifist nature; despite being a ninja and Zabuza's tool of battle, Haku dislikes fighting and does all that he can to subdue opponents without actually killing them.

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Re: Haku was a GIRL, not a boy!

Post by Sasami Jurai »

Thank you, Mo. :mrgreen:
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Re: Haku was a GIRL, not a boy!

Post by Choushin_Destroyer »

You didn't spend enough time researching! No, just being sarcastic. I'm a bit sleptical about the pictures of Haku where...it, for our purposes...supposedly has breasts. I think it looks more like the fold of the clothes or maybe they do exist.

I we ask Kishimoto-san ourselves, and see what he says. This will finalize it perhaps.
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Re: Haku was a GIRL, not a boy!

Post by spinch1 »

Haku is definitely male. I was one of the few to find out about Haku's gender and my response was much like Naruto's only 5 times worse. But Haku is still cool and I wish he were still around with Zabuza.
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Re: Haku was a GIRL, not a boy!

Post by Choushin_Destroyer »

Yeeeaaaaahh...my money's on Haku being male. I'm skeptical. The agrument in favor of feminity just seems less than fully baked to me, and more enthusiastic rather than educated. Sorry, man. But there are plenty of other characters who ARE what gender they appear. I think you MIGHT be right, but I wouldn't count on it.
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Re: Haku was a GIRL, not a boy!

Post by DeathAce »

It is an accepted fact (though it doesn't seem widely spread) that Haku is a boy (or was, anyhow), which is why I voted male. But since we're free to give our opinions, I might as well say this: I hated as much as y'all did when it was proclaimed he's a dude, and evenmore when he died.

In fact, when I first started reading the Shonen Jump at issue 5 or 6 six years ago (dunno, gotta check the now paperweight ^^) the first thing I read was Naruto, and the fight between Zabuza and Kakashi. Even being 9 or 10 at the time, the gender-blender made me laugh (and a lil' upset, hey, i was 9, didn't know manga was supposed to be weird)but the death of Haku actually made me cry xD(had to hide it T_T). This sickened me so much, I actually stoppedd reading SJ for about 6 months and after about a year, I forgot what Naruto was, though I did flip through the SJs I had. Sadly (or thankfully?) I've recently rekindled my interest in Naruto and that it is good material for fanfics! In fact, the one I'm writing (or at least brainstorming for) includes a FEMALE (yeaa...I'm a hypocrite "fo' rizzle.") Haku. Won't disclose the summary, yet, but if you want a preview or to ask about about it, ask in a month or so and I MAY have a chapter or two ready (gotta make it good, it's for the people ^^).

But, I've gotten off topic, Haku is indeed a MALE. You can hate it, love it, think it sucks (I did..and do), but you've gotta admit, it fits perfectly. If it was a FEMALE Haku, the first (or second) meeting between "her" and NAruto would've had a different, and less funny ending. It would've been like switching Zabuza's and his roles and listing Zabuza as being "pure as the newly fallen snow."

Well, to end my 2c and not to bore you guys and gals any longer, I'll just say this. Whether you still think Haku is a dude or dudette, you can always write a fanfic ^^ That's what they're for so use it! Anime and manga were created to fulfill fantasies and to incite ideas for us, so yeaa....

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Re: Haku was a GIRL, not a boy!

Post by Keilu »

Iwas upset to when I found out Haku was a boy XD He was such a pretty girl XD But well, it's funny to make characters like that (I know it because on my own stories I do that sometimes XD) Still he is so cute x3 and one of my favorite minor characters hehe.
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Re: Haku was a GIRL, not a boy!

Post by Im Lawliet »

still, even with his being a boy, i cudnt get used to the voice no matter what i did.
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Re: Haku was a GIRL, not a boy!

Post by Sasami Jurai »

Haku's just an androgynous boy.
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Re: Haku was a GIRL, not a boy!

Post by hitachiinhinata »

I have done some research of my own. We all know that Masashi Kishimoto likes to use names that reveal something about the characters ie, Naruto-ramen topping, Sakura-pink cherry blossom, Saru-monkey, right? Well, the name 'Haku' means 'to put on (a sword)'. Does that tell you anything? :-k
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Re: Haku was a GIRL, not a boy!

Post by Believe it! »

:fly:

Everyone can relax. Believe it! has returned!

And I'm ready for war...

:nunchuck:

So lets get to it. First off, please check the first post for NEW PROOF that Haku was a girl, or click here: http://www.narutocommunity.net/forums/H ... 25207.html

Now for the posts.
louise101 wrote:grr this is so annoiying! Haku is a guy.
My proof to you is that he constantly refurs to himself as male
Oh, constantly huh? Well then cite two times she referred to herself as a male.
louise101 wrote:he doesnt have breasts
She does, and I have posted new proof from the manga about this as well.

http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/4990/haku1ft9.png

http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/3291 ... 1evke5.jpg
louise101 wrote:it is not unusual to have girly looking men with homoerotic tendancies in anime.
I've addressed this already. Pointing to other animes is not relevant. What is relevant is what is usual for the Naruto series. Or would you like me to point to various animes where girls have pretended to be boys?

How about this? We'll both stick to examples in the Naruto series, okay? Here are my examples of females who were mistaken to be males!

1. Haku
2. Sasame of the Fuuma clan
3. Kagerou of the Fumma clan
4. Toki, who posed as her brother Lord Sagi
5. Natsuhi, Sumaru's mother and protector of the Star Village's star (she was thought to be a male while wearing the gas mask)
6. Princess Haruna, posed as a male named Shune

Click here for pictures: http://forums.narutofan.com/showpost.ph ... tcount=221

So there you have five other examples of females who were mistaken to be males in the Naruto series.

Where are your examples of feminine looking males with homosexual tendencies in the Naruto series? I'll settle for examples of males who were mistaken to be females in the Naruto series. So what have you got?
louise101 wrote:I love anime i draw it all the time and aspire to create beautiful male charaters like Haku.
So it would pain you to find out that you're the victim of a “fake trap”? You thought Haku was a bishounen, only to find out from me that Haku was actually...

A GIRL!!
louise101 wrote:Anyways i believe that Haku was dressed as a female due to personal prefrance and a desire to hide his identity.
And from where did this personal preference originate? Haku was orphaned at around age 8, and she was raised by Zabuza after that. She was a part of Zabuza's followers, which included the Demon Brothers Gozu and Meizu. So tell me, how could a boy develop a taste in female clothes if he was raised by a cut throat shinobi like Zabuza who only wanted him to be a strong killer like he was, AND raised around boys like Gozu and Meizu? Are you telling me that Zabuza encouraged such a habit? Or worse yet, paid for the expenses of the female clothing? And for what purpose? To make his male weapon an effeminate sissy?

And if the female dress was to hide Haku's identity, then obviously the dress would have to be considered a disguise. So when the disguise worked on Naruto, who was Haku's enemy, and it made him believe that Haku was a girl, why then did Haku contradict the disguise by saying “Oh, by the way... I'm a man.”? Seems to me like Haku would want Naruto to be incorrect about her identity, and if you think Haku being female is the incorrect conclusion, then why did Haku correct Naruto?
louise101 wrote:I think he told Naruto that he was a boy because even though he was enemies with him, he felt he understood Naruto and felt he could trust him.(He could have killed Naruto easily)
Trust him to do what? To not let that vital piece of info slip to any tracker ninja that could have asked him about it? You've got to understand that Haku wasn't in a position to trust her enemies with any true information about herself. Anything true about her would only help the trackers get closer to catching her.
louise101 wrote:And for his feminine appearence, just a trick by the creator to show that the character is to some extent overly innocent and misunderstood,It is hard to draw an innocent looking male character so the easiest way is to make them look feminine.
Yet he does this well enough with masculine characters such as Naruto, Chouji, Kabuto (when they first meet him), Konohamaru, Rock Lee, etc. Also, Orochimaru looks somewhat feminine, but he doesn't look innocent at all. So I think you're opinion is baseless.
louise101 wrote:You are sooo stubborn about proving a male character that is pretty and has homoerotic tendancies to be a woman that it sounds like you have your own damn issues about homosexuality.
My objections to deviant sexualities are irrelevant to this issue, because where homosexual characters or relationships do exist, I have no problem recognizing them as being such. The problem here is that the canon facts of the series PROVE that Haku was a heterosexual girl.

So it isn't because I can't call a spade a spade. It's because Haku was not a spade.
louise101 wrote:In final i will say i think most ppl agree with me.
I will say that most people believe that Haku was a boy, but that doesn't mean they're right. In fact, they're either uninformed, or they are willfully incorrect. You are willfully incorrect, because you've read the truth that Haku was a girl, yet you choose to deny the truth and go with your own baseless theory. And that's fine. I'm not trying to force you to agree with the truth. You're free to believe whatever you want, it makes no difference to me.
louise101 wrote:this is really dumb but i feel a strong need to stand up for my favourite dead anime hero.
Well no it's not dumb, because I feel the same way. Haku is a great character and she is a very important part of the series. She is one of the most influential characters in the series, and she is my second favorite character. Second only to Naruto. So yes, I feel that I should stand up for the brilliance behind her character and spread the truth about the full depth of her character, which includes her being a female. Believe it!
louise101 wrote:I really hope you come and reply to this...I could go on about this for ages:)
Well sorry for not replying in a long time, but whenever I would check this forum there would be no activity, and I think the mods hid the topic from view on the forum's thread list, so I had just given up on it. But now I'm back, and I can take on anything you can dish out. So feel free to rant away. Thanks for the post and for reading the thread. Be sure to read it again so you can see the new proof that I posted.
Battousai The Manslayer wrote:Haku is the only guy I will every consider attractive. His appearance contradicting his true gender angers me greatly. Does God Exist?
Haku was not a guy.

And yes God exists. He send His son Jesus to die on the cross for our sins. And unlike the “Raptor Jesus” in your sig, Jesus Christ did not stay dead. He rose again and lives today. So I suggest you pray to him and ask him to save you from your sins and come into your life.

If anyone wants to talk more about that PM me.
tears~of~blood wrote:Is this the same "Believe it!" from AF?
Believe it!
tears~of~blood wrote:You said Haku had breasts.
I did more than say it, I proved it. Look at the canon pics I posted.
tears~of~blood wrote:(at least in the other thread, I didn't bother reading this one) Well, you're probably just seeing lumps in his baggy clothes. I own the episodes with Haku. And I've noticed, if you look at him when he's fighting, you see a slope to the rope around his waist.
That's not what I'm referring to. The curve in battle clothing at her waist is the result of baggy clothing, but when she wore her pink kimono the curve appeared on her chest, far above the sash wore on her waist.
tears~of~blood wrote:And, Listen to what they call him. HE and BOY.
And tracker. Don't forget they called her a tracker ninja as well. So I guess that means she was a tracker ninja too huh?
tears~of~blood wrote:Plus, ever heard of bishounen?
Yes, it is a character drawn like a female but is given the storyline of a male. That is irrelevant to this issue, because Haku was not a bishounen. She was a female who lied about her true identity.
tears~of~blood wrote:And with how he feels about Zabuza, they do love each other, if you've seen all the episodes it's obvious.
Yes I know it's obvious. That's why I list it as proof that Haku was a girl.
tears~of~blood wrote:Ever heard of guys liking guys? It is possible.
It is possible, but not in Haku's case. I proved this in my first post.
tears~of~blood wrote:You don't have to be a girl to like a guy. That's proven.
But Haku DOES have to be a girl to like Zabuza. That's proven.

Fact: Haku wanted to have purpose.
Fact: Zabuza wanted to rule over the land of water.

Fact: Only a female could be Zabuza's lover.
Fact: A boy could not possibly have purpose in being Zabuza's lover.

Thus, Haku must have female, and could not have possibly been male.
tears~of~blood wrote:And boys that are practically girls are not uncommon in anime.
But they are very uncommon in the anime known as "Naruto".
tears~of~blood wrote:For example, Jakotsu from Inuyasha. He's another one like Haku. (but he's stupid) So why don't you just do this about Haku being a girl.
Because Haku was a girl, and pointing out characters from other animes does nothing to help your case. After all, I can point out dozens of characters from other animes that are girls who were mistaken for boys. Would my doing that prove in any way that Haku was such a character? No, and neither does your pointing out effeminate male characters in any way prove that Haku was that type of character.
tears~of~blood wrote:Sorry if I sound rude. Haku is one of my fave characters. So I try to make sure people get his gender right.They are always with me. Whether I want them or not. Ghosts.
No, that wasn't rude, and I feel the same way. I also try to make sure that people get her gender right. The difference is that I use facts to back myself up.
Battousai The Manslayer wrote:Women seem to like guys that look like chicks. It's how they embrace and connect with their inner lesbian without having to worry about any accusations of being attracted to other women.
Yeah, but I still accuse them of it nonetheless.
KoYue wrote:And guys can't seem to accept the fact that some men do look more girly than any girl possibly could.
Actually that is not a fact. No male can ever look more girly than ANY girl could. That's just dumb to suggest otherwise. Show me any male made up or surgically altered to look like a female, and I'll show you a REAL female who looks 100 times better.
Gyro Zeppeli wrote:This reminds me of a thread from the Naruto forums not too long ago
And if I had been able to post there, I would have proven that Haku was not a trap. She was a "reverse trap".
Pink Supervisor|EL wrote:lol i just think this guy can't accept he finds Haku attractive, while trying to be straight
I don't find configurations of ink lines and colorations of paint attractive, but even if one were to assume that Haku was a boy, the character design is still that of a female character. So the only ones who would have trouble being straight while finding Haku attractive would be females.
DReality wrote:I believe he is most certainly male, and that Believe It is simply unwilling to accept this because of this little theory he has
I am unwilling to accept your hypothesis because the facts of the series prove that Haku was female. I am merely pointing out the facts. If you have a problem with Haku being a girl then you should probably take it up with Musashi Kishimoto, the creator of the series and of Haku.
DReality wrote:and because he refuses to give actual consideration to the evidence others
No, actually I respond to everything that people post in response to the proof I have presented, and I refute what is submitted by the other side. Thus, I do give heavy consideration to what others post.
DReality wrote:out forward while being under the impression that his theory is 100% correct.
Well there are only 1 of 2 possibilities here, so one side MUST be 100% correct. The questions are which side is correct, and what do I think is the probability that I am correct? I believe that the probability is about 99.9% because the facts of the series prove that Haku must have been a girl. The only way Haku could have been a boy is if Kishimoto did not intend for this part of the series to make sense. In other words, Haku could have only been a boy if the canon facts of the series are of no consequence to Kishimoto. I believe this is very unlikely, as he has stated that the wave arc is one of the most important and loved arcs of all that he's written so far.
DReality wrote:Other than that, I believe this kid is just attempting to get a rise out of people for the sole purpose of getting kicks
I have devoted many hours to this cause. I would not spend so much time on this, nor on replying to people like you, if I didn't take this issue to heart.
DReality wrote:though the fact that he puts so much time and effort into the posts and threads he makes it seem like he's just a stubborn retard with nothing better to do with his time. Hell, his kind of thing isn't even worth the lulz for the time it takes up.
I do many other things with my time as well. This is just one of many hobbies that I use to keep my debating skills sharp. And while I'm doing that, why not talk about a series and a character that I appreciate?
DReality wrote:I have some links to other copies of this thread that are out and around on various sites, on which the overwhelming majority of posters believe Haku is male and provide evidence, and Believe It!! refuses to acknowledge this.
It's not an overwhelming majority. It is a slight majority. And it gets slighter as time goes on and more people start waking up to the truth.

You can't blame the majority for being ignorant of the fact that Haku was a girl. After all, people have been thinking that ever since they read the mistranslated mangas or watched the poorly translated fansubs or even the dub. Those came out way before I first watched the dub and learned of Haku, let alone compiled all the proof that she was a girl and posted it on the Internet.
tears~of~blood wrote:Oh, and, Belive it!, I don't give a crap what you say. I'm sticking to the FACT that Haku is a BOY!
You can believe whatever you want. I don't care. But if you're going to post, why not provide this little "fact" of yours? Prove that Haku was a boy, if you can.
tears~of~blood wrote:And I'm probably going to be done with this thread. I can belive what I want to belive. So, I leave with this, you are an idiot. You refuse to belive facts
Well let the record show that you were the first to insult me simply for disagreeing with you. Of course, that's all those on your side know how to do, insult and try to shut down those you disagree with.

The truth is that I am the only one who has posted facts here, and the all prove that Haku was a girl. Now, if you have facts that prove otherwise, post them. I dare you. Then see how I refute them using actual facts from the canon series!
tears~of~blood wrote:you try so hard to fight against something that is not even true
Quote of the day! Thanks for admitting that I'm right. Yes, I am fighting AGAINST something that isn't true: Your idea that Haku was a boy.

And you know what else? I win that fight every time. Believe it!
tears~of~blood wrote:and the only way you can make me belive otherwise is by getting Masashi Kishimoto on here to tell me himself. And, don't reply to this. I am NOT coming back to this completely pointless thread.
I reply to everything that is relevant, just to show that I consider everyone's opinions and to prove them wrong.
louise101 wrote:here proof of Haku being a guy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IJdpCodv_Wc
haku standing in the boys line...lol at the bathroom:p cameo appearance but never the less.
Prove that she was standing in the boys line. As a matter of fact, prove that it was even her. You can't.

Truth is, that episode was nothing but a gag, a joke. There were plenty of other characters that did not belong in that line either, including Vash the Stampede from Trigun.
Aoi Sakuraba wrote:Really this is a non issue Haku himself clearly states he is a boy when he finds Naruto passed out in the forest, which is why Naruto freaked out because he thought Haku was a girl.
Well then I guess it's also a non-issue if Haku herself clearly said that she was a tracker ninja who had been sent to kill Zabuza.

Ya hear that everyone? Haku was a male tracker ninja and HE killed Zabuza!

But, if we really are going by what Haku said to Naruto, then it might surprise you to find out that Haku didn't actually tell Naruto that she was a boy. That was a mistranslation!

Ya see, the truth is that in the original Japanese version, the official version, Haku told Naruto that she was an "otoko", which means "man". So there you have it. A 15 year old girl claimed to be a man, even though she was too young to be considered one even if she really had been a male. So, it is a FACT that Haku lied to Naruto.

And that is why this was a double joke. The first joke was that Naruto was actually gullible enough to believe such a lie, and the second was that he felt weird about thinking she was pretty.
Saya wrote:Is there really a debate over this? Haku called himself a male, so did Zabuza and everyone else.
Everyone? As I recall, Naruto called her a female. And as I also recall, the others, including Haku, called her a tracker ninja as well. So does that make it the truth?

You should probably be aware of something that exists all throughout this series. It's called "deception".
Saya wrote:Just because you look like a female does not make you a female.
I know that. I even said this in my presentation. That's why I don't rely only looks alone to prove that Haku was a girl.
Karin Rengu wrote:Still, I'd have to say Haku was a girl. It seemed she was in love with Zabuza (he could have been gay though)
Thanks for posting, and agreeing that Haku was a girl. But I must point out that it is not possible for Haku to have been a homosexual. Consider the facts:

Fact: Zabuza told Haku that he did not want friendship or compassion from her.
Fact: He wanted a weapon.
Fact: Haku understood this.
Fact: Later on, Haku showed physical attraction to Zabuza despite the previous facts.
Fact: Haku desired a life with purpose.

So what purpose would there be in defying Zabuza's demand?

The answer is simple. Haku, who desired to have purpose in life, willfully disregarded Zabuza's demand of no friendship/compassion because she was planning for her next purpose in life. Once Zabuza had become the ruler over the land of water, he would no longer need Haku as a weapon. Her purpose would end.

However, eventually Zabuza would need to make sure that his bloodline stayed in power over his land. For this he would need children, and for those he would need a woman. A strong woman. Well, who better than the woman who fought beside him all those years and knows him best? What better mother than one with a kekkei genkai trait to pass on to his children? That was the purpose that Haku was dreaming of when she chose to show attraction and affection for Zabuza. That is the purpose she would fulfill once her current purpose as a tool ended. The purpose of being a wife and mother would last the rest of her life.

Now, taking all of that into consideration, what purpose would there be for Haku in any of that had she been a boy? Zabuza would not have taken a male as a mate. He couldn't have had children with a male. So what purpose would a boy have in breaking Zabuza's demand of no compassion or friendship? What purpose would a boy have in being attracted to Zabuza or having affection for him?

None. That's why I say, it is impossible for Haku to have been a homosexual male. There would be no purpose to it, and Haku was all about having a purpose.
Karin Rengu wrote:but I think she said she was a dude so that Zabuza wouldn't look down on her as "inferior" like a lot of guys tend to do.
Possible, but I think Zabuza knew that she was a girl. That's why he tolerated her shortcomings in battle, and her gentle nature.
Saya wrote:Haku was a male. Haku didn't love Zabuza as a lover, but as family...like a father.
Wrong.

http://img113.imageshack.us/img113/5204/hakusgyq7.png

She said "I just didn't want to scar your beautiful/flawless body", and she said it while blushing. That is clear proof that she was physically attracted to Zabuza.
BornToBeDeviant wrote:Is it really important?
Yes. Haku is one of the most important and influential characters in the series, and Kishimoto considers her and Zabuza's story to be one of his favorites.
BornToBeDeviant wrote:Well gay guys, guys who like to cross dress and guys who have feminine faces exist in real life, so what's so strange if someone like taht is included in the manga too?
It's strange if it doesn't fit the personality or background of the character.
Commander Sparx wrote:He is boy, he said it him self it when Naruto was trying to 'Dig' him thinking he was a girl.
She lied to Naruto, and that's a fact. Believe it!
Karin Rengu wrote:There seems to be more feminine men in manga than in real life though because feminine looking men are hot! As long as you can still tell they are guys.
Uhh... no, there are feminine looking males in manga than in real life because manga are NOT real life.

Also, any woman who thinks a feminine looking male is hot, is a lesbian (or bisexual at least).
Karin Rengu wrote:I know Haku's said he's a dude but I can't help but feel something's not right there
That's how I felt when she said she was a tracker ninja.
recca12 wrote:That is a compelling arguement. But all it takes is one minor flaw to discredit its validity.
Thanks for the compliment. However, one minor flaw isn't nearly enough to discredit the whole thing. After all, the Hakubuki or boy Haku theory is loaded with major flaws, yet people still cling to it.

But I don't believe the Geishaku or girl Haku fact has any flaws whatsoever.
recca12 wrote:I will offer my thoughts but I will admit I didn't read all of that lol.
Then allow me to sum it all up in one sentence. Haku was a girl because she looked, sounded, and acted like it in every way.
recca12 wrote:The best way to settle the discussion is not to come up with a conclusion based on observation alone, because there is no concluding factor from the writer himself, which means that all you have is evidence for both sides of the arguement but no definate answer.
Actually I don't prevent strong evidence for the other side. Mainly I present facts for my side and facts against the other side.

Sure there has been no definite answer from Kishimoto, but I think the series itself proves that Haku was a girl quite well.
recca12 wrote:Since we don't have a verbal answer from the artist or writer, all you can do is interpret their goal and see which side of the aruement it follows more closely.
The girl Haku storyline is the only one that makes sense, so that must be the correct one.
recca12 wrote:Both of Haku's parents died when he was young. He had no father figure to follow
She had her father until she was about 8 or so. Then soon after, she went with Zabuza. She also interacted with the Demon Brothers, as well as the other nameless ninja that followed Zabuza. So she had plenty of male figures in her life. Had she been a male herself she would have easily emulated any one of them. However, what she lacked was a female role model. Yet despite that fact she looked, dressed, and acted like one. How can this be unless she found these traits within herself as a natural result of her true female gender?
recca12 wrote:he lost his mother before he had any solid foundation in his persona.
I disagree. Haku was old enough to have established some personality and sense of self. She was certainly old enough to remember those times, as well as the instance where she was scolded by her mother and attacked by her father. She was also mature enough to fed for herself on the streets until Zabuza found her.
recca12 wrote:One could say that Zabuza was a father figure to him but since Zabuza had refered to him as a boy and Haku refered to himself as a boy you must conclude that his appearance was merely the artist's view of his character.
That would be a baseless and illogical assumption. Your premise is flawed first of all, because even if Zabuza did call her a boy, such a thing would make no difference in why she turned out to be so feminine. In other words, Zabuza calling a boy and boy would not cause him to be feminine, nor would him calling a girl a boy cause her to be feminine. All that can be said is that it would make a boy masculine and a girl masculine. If this were the case, then the girl Haku storyline makes the most sense because Haku did have some tomboyish traits about her and she was able to convince team 7 that she was a boy. On the other hand, it doesn't make sense that Zabuza's calling a boy a boy would cause him to look and act feminine.

Second of all, there is no evidence that Zabuza called her a boy as a matter of private conversation. In the manga and anime Zabuza never refers to her as a male when it is just the two of them. He always calls her a child or a kid. So in reality, Zabuza may have acknowledged that she was a girl, but set it up so that he would call her a boy when in the company of others in order to hide her true identity and make her more useful as a shinobi.

Third, you can't dismiss Haku's appearance as how the artist views her character. It is more likely that Kishimoto designed Haku to look, act, and dress like a girl for a very important reason. After all, it is blatantly stated that Haku has a high regard for having a purpose in life. So it is likely that there was purpose in looking, acting, and dressing like a girl, just as it is likely that there was purpose in her pretending to be a male in front of enemies. I have listed these reasons and other possible reasons in my presentation.

So your premise lacks logic, basis, and purpose. No offense, that's just my observation of your argument.
recca12 wrote:The artist does not intend for the audience to be trapped in limbo trying to figure out one way or the other unless it bears heavily on the the story as a whole.
Which it does. The main lesson that Kakashi was teaching them right before this mission was to see through deception. Haku was introduced to the audience and to team 7 as a deceptive character. One of the first things out of her mouth was a complete lie. So the issue of her gender, which was a focus of at least one episode, was an issue that did bear heavily on the story as a whole, and it provided more depth to Haku's character. It caused us to think about her motives and her reasons for looking like a girl but getting her opponents to think she was a boy. It forced us to look deeper into her past and her psyche.
recca12 wrote:A good artist wants to see his point and how everything matches up with that. Haku's character is submissive and loyal. His pink kimono and his feminin voice only points to the arist's goal of enlightening aspects of Haku's story (who is he not, what is he). Haku being a girl and claiming he is a boy bears no wieght on his story.
That's your opinion, and even if it were correct, there are a lot of things in the series that bear no weight on the story, like all of the stupid jokes and gags that go on. In fact, if Haku had been a boy, then dressing like a girl would bear no weight. It would just be some meaningless behavior that has no origin or purpose. And what about when Haku told Naruto that she was a man, and he freaked out. Did that bear any weight on the story?
recca12 wrote:It's more of a distraction away of what the artist wants you to learn of him.
How is it a distraction? It is a part of her character. And who are you to say what the artist wants us to learn?
recca12 wrote:It would make much more sence if he looked like a boy but was really a girl. His denial, then, by saying "I'm a boy" would be more relevent. He truely would be hiding his (or in this arguement her) identity.
What?!?! That would make no sense at all! The entire point of pretending to be a boy was to throw enemies and trackers off from her true identity, which was female. If a girl who looked like a boy claimed to be a boy while fighting for Zabuza, then the trackers would hunt for a boy. Then, upon seeing this "boy" the trackers would assume it was a boy, thus making the girl a target. Her saying that she isn't a boy at that point would do nothing to deter the trackers.

Your idea makes sense in a separate and different series, but it makes no sense for Haku and no sense in this series and here's why...

First, lets start with the truth. Haku was a girl who looked like a girl. So your saying what would make more sense is irrelevant. She was what she was. Next, lets add the problem, which is that she and Zabuza were being hunted by tracker ninja. Thus, Haku had an interest in protecting her identity. She fought in battle as a "male", but she went out into the world as a "female" to gather herbs and supplies. That way, any trackers would think Zabuza's partner was a male, leaving Haku free to roam about the country as her true female self without being detected. If she were to be stopped by trackers, she would have all the female characteristics to prove that she was not a male, and thus could not be Zabuza's partner.

Simple.
recca12 wrote:This is seen in a lot of other mangas.
But not in this one, and that's the one we're talking about. So lets stick with the Naruto series. There have not been any instances of that in the Naruto series, but there HAVE been numerous instances where females have pretended to be males, and were even mistaken for males! Read my reply above to another member to see these examples.
recca12 wrote:Instead, he is dress as a girl but says he's a boy, so you have to take his word over physical appearance.
Right, just like I have to take her word when he claims to be a tracker ninja while she's wearing a tracker ninja mask!

Come on man. Be logical! She isn't merely dressed like a girl, she looks, sounds, and acts like a girl too.

And what would be the point of a boy dressing up like a girl and then saying that he was a boy. He'd be saying that he was a drag queen, basically. So what, was Haku just some mixed up tranny looking for social ridicule?

Just think it through. Consider all the facts I posted.
recca12 wrote:I could go on and on about this but I have to go. Then main thing to take out of this is just ask yourself "What is the artist/writer telling me?" or "what point is the artist trying to make?".
That Haku was a girl who had to go against who she was at even the most fundamental of levels in order to be the tool that Zabuza wanted, but in her own ways she discovered how to be true to herself and fulfill her purpose to Zabuza.
Nathan~Chevalier wrote:so stop trying to make everyone see things ur way and let people see things the way they want to see them
Hmm...

NO!

I have a better idea. How about I post an alternative that people are free to accept or reject, and you can take a hike?
Nathan~Chevalier wrote:so to make my point clear stop putting so much enphasis on this and just enjoy the anime it was made to enjoy and watch.
No. I'll do both. I'll emphasize the truth that Haku was a girl, and I will enjoy the anime. What do you think of that?
Nathan~Chevalier wrote:stop trying to act like ur a know it all its dumb and sad. if u find this insulting ur not reading this very well, and this is geared towards the guy or girl who started this dumb research
I see. It's geared toward the guy who started the discussion, not those who joined in and turned it into a debate. Well ya know what I think? I think you're nothing but a hypocrite. You tell me to let people think what they want, then you tell me to shut up. No, why don't you leave the thread.

In fact, I hereby ban you from this thread. You are not allowed to post anymore.

:banned:
Zeo Inuzuka wrote:Ok this is how I am going to put this. In Japan there is alot of Transexuals, not having anything agaists Japan.
Actually, no there aren't. You're thinking Bangkok or Thailand.
Zeo Inuzuka wrote:i think in the origanal Japan version Haku was meant to be a Transexual.
Wrong answer again. In both versions Haku is meant to be a girl who merely pretends to be a boy in order to hide her true identity. This is more obvious in the Japanese version however, as they use gender specific words, and because Haku told Naruto she was a man in the Japanese version, which means what she said was presented as a very obvious and very blatant lie.
Zeo Inuzuka wrote:But in USA you can have a transexual on T.V. So that is my theory. i think Haku is nither a boy nor girl but both.
There is no such thing as both.
oyuky wrote:im pretty sure haku is a boy
in manga and in japan homosexuality is very accepted and normal
No it isn't. Homosexuality is less accepted in Japan than it is in America. Do the research and look it up. They still block homosexuals from buying houses, getting jobs, getting same-sex "married", etc. They also openly make fun of homosexuals in Japan. Something that a station would get shut down over if they tried it in America.
oyuky wrote:and since he wasnt actually called "gay"it would still be allowed in the US.
That would just prove my point further. Haku still shows physical attraction to Zabuza, even in the dub. Which means it was left in there because the actual storyline shows that Haku was a girl who had a normal attraction to a male.
oyuky wrote:and naruto isnt really targeted to little kids since alot of little kids dont get stuff like "pervy sage" and the sexy jutsu stuff.
It's not geared toward kids, but it still has elements that kids like. So yes, the target audience is 7 and up.
oyuky wrote:its pretty obvious haku might have romantic feelings for zabuza.
No, it's obvious that she DOES have romantic feelings for Zabuza.
oyuky wrote:also it could seem like he has small breasts but its probably just his clothes.
See the pics I posted. I proved that she did have breasts.
oyuky wrote:he also calls himself"boku" not "watashi" indicating he himself prefers to be called male.
Wrong. She used boku in front of enemies, which is something girls use as well. However, when she was with Zabuza she used the word atashi, which is female speak. This suggests she is actually a female, and only speaks as one when she is with Zabuza.
oyuky wrote:he also says he is male.
She also says she is a tracker ninja who has been sent to kill Zabuza. She also says that Sasuke was killed. She also says that she will kill Naruto and Sasuke.

In short, she lies.
oyuky wrote:in japan some men dress as women b/c it calms them.
Those males are not trained shinobi. Haku was a trained shinobi.
oyuky wrote:also haku could just want to play the role as "zabuza's girl" or partner which would normally mean one of them must be a girl.
There is no purpose in Haku playing such a role. If Zabuza were to have such a relationship with a boy, it would directly conflict with and prevent his dream from coming true, which was to become the ruler of the land of water.
oyuky wrote:and i highly doubt zabuza would be the girl.
Yet you assume he would consider a boy to be his "girl". I highly doubt he would do either one.
oyuky wrote:on the other hand he could be a girl. he looks like a girl and acts really feminine
Ya think?
oyuky wrote:and he never actually said he was "in love" wth zabuza so hif hes a guy he might not even be gay.
If Haku had been a boy then she would have to be homosexual as well because Haku clearly showed physical attraction to Zabuza. It was also stated in the series that Haku really loved Zabuza. So yeah, she was either a normal teenage girl, or an abnormal cross dressing homosexual. Which one seems more logical?
oyuky wrote:who knows? i dont know why this question is never in interviews.
Probably because Kishimoto wants people to debate it.
Scarlet_Hope wrote:I think Haku was a boy. But either way it doesn't matter coz he's dead now.
Yes it does matter because Haku is still one of the most influential characters in the series.
thereaper6324 wrote:I disagree, you state that Haku was a girl and told others "she" was a boy to throw them off of his/her true gender and deceive his/her opponenents. If Haku really did want to decieve them why not dress and act like a boy if she was a girl. But to be quite honest this is my only argument... everything else that I had to support that Haku was a guy you adressed and contradicted really well, nice job.
Thank you, and to answer your question, she did dress and act like a boy. That is the whole point of her battle clothing. It was even convincing enough to fool Kakashi.

Now, when she went out dressed as a girl in her pink kimono, she was out gathering herbs. This was her reward for pretending to be a boy while fighting. Since enemies thought Zabuza's partner was a boy, she was free to walk about the woods and town dressed as her true self without fear of being targeted by the enemy.
MaoAiHoshi wrote:Haku honestly was probably a boy. They probably just made it look like he was a girl, to make a little TWIST in the series... make it more interesting.
Except that the facts indicate that she was a girl, and could not have possibly been a male. So the twist was in that she was being deceptive about her gender. Plus, her saying that she was a man set Naruto up for quite the practical joke.
Aoi Sakuraba wrote:This whole thread is so pointless, Haku says it himself that he was a boy, accept that and stop thinking of bs "what if" excuses to say he's a girl.
This whole thread is so pointless, Haku says it herself that she was a tracker, accept that and stop thinking of bs "what if" excuses to say she's not.
Bellus wrote:It's freaking amazing how much information and details you have to back Haku being a girl up. Really, kudos for your work!
Thank you.
Bellus wrote:I initially thought Haku was a girl, but I never really read the manga or watched the shows so my opinion was just based off looks. So it was surprising to me to find that some people considered Haku a boy, and after a bit of internet surfing I found lots of claims supporting both theories.

But honestly, yours is a thousand times better than the others I've read.
Well I really appreciate you saying so.
Bellus wrote:Sooooo, after I'm done writing this I'll be voting that Haku is a Girl. To me it just makes a helluva lot more sense that way.

Excellent Job
Thank you for reading, posting, and voting. I hope you check the first post again because I have put even more evidence in it.
Scarlet_deciever wrote:And I think Haku is a hemophrodite. There you have it!
No such thing.
SoubisSacrifice wrote:Probably a little late for me to come in, but oh well.
Never too late. Look at me, I'm posting over 2 years later.
SoubisSacrifice wrote:I am actually undecided about this. I've heard both debates, but my mind is just about made up that Haku is a girl, merely from this still-image taken from the dvd:
Please repost or tell me what image you're talking about. The link you provided no longer works.
SoubisSacrifice wrote:It really looks like Haku has a nice set of breasts to me....
Ha ha ha! Okay. Well, they certainly are undeniable proof, so I welcome them based on that reason alone. Thanks for the post.
Sasami Jurai wrote:Naruto's "Official" Wikipedia!! (Wikipedia never lies!!)
Wikipedia is a blog that is run by fascists who protect their ideas and push them as facts while blocking out any real facts that contradict them.
Sasami Jurai wrote:That's all I have to say about Haku's gender. He might have possibly been a homosexual, though.
That would be impossible according to the facts of the series. There would be no purpose in that.
Kesarion wrote:Superbly done, I always believed Haku was a girl. I love Haku

Even if someone actually came with ultimate evidence that it wasn't so I'd still lie to myself that she was because she really impressed me as a character in both the manga and the anime
Thank you for the compliment.
Kesarion wrote:Doesn't it seem normal for her to actually be a girl after all she does untill she dies, only a girl would act like that. From a psichological standpoint it does look as tough she strugles not to break on the outside. Inside she's torn with feelings that she keeps hidden untill they overwhelm her at the end. A truly incredible character, she brought some tears to my eyes and created a superb ending. Whoever thought up her character was a genius.
Exactly right. That's why her character is so deep and meaningful.
Kesarion wrote:Aside from that I think the most profound aspect that no one ever noticed is her eyes.. those eyes could only belong to a woman.. even if it's just a manga.
I have always made a big deal out of her eyes, though not in regard to this debate. Haku talks about having the same eyes as Zabuza in the series, and the anime also shows her eyes close up a lot to emphasize this theme.
Kesarion wrote:I believe Masashi Kishimoto wanted us to believe what we saw not what we heard and so in the manga we have the everlasting theme of Deceit wich is the base of most of Konoha's enemy shinobi's lives.
Correct! Correct.
Kesarion wrote:Anyway as a side question I'm wondering why 99% of the guys believe/wish she was a guy ? What's wrong with you people are you all gay or what ?
Ha ha ha! I have wondered that as well, and that's the only answer I can come up with. That they want Haku to have been a pretty boy because they are attracted to that sort of thing.
rich wrote:Haku is abviously a boy, you can tell just by looking at him. Same goes for Yuukimaru.
Oh yeah, sure...

http://www.animegalleries.net/img/282497
hvk wrote:I believe Haku was a boy, even after reading all of your information. While I understand where you're coming from rather well actually, I just don't think Kishimoto would be that deceptively brilliant, when the rest of the series is so simply straight forward, no offense meant but it sounded like you were reading too far into it to find facts that detectives would miss in what you've claimed to be a kids show. That is all.
That's cool. Thanks for reading it.

But I think Kishimoto's series is complex and deep all throughout. It's not that straightforward at all in my opinion.
spike383 wrote:well, seriously. the creator of naruto itself wrote it in the manga. haku, gender = male.
Wrong. He wrote no such thing.
spike383 wrote:makes no sense he would be lying.
And yet it is a proven fact that she did lie. Ya know why I can call that a fact? Because in the Japanese version Haku tells Naruto that she is a MAN, not a boy, a man. However, besides having to be a male for this to work, she'd also have to be an adult, which she was not. That means what she was was a blatant lie.

So yes, in fact she was lying when she said that.
spike383 wrote:there happen to be alot "transgender" characters in japanese animes/games like Poison in (Final Fight) and others.
Actually Poison, and by the same token Roxy as well, are both females. They were created as females and they were not changed in the slightest even after some idiot at Capcom of Japan blurted out what he did about transvestites. Capcom of America confirms that they are both females.

But in any case, the existence of trannies or bishounen in other anime series does not prove that Haku was such a character. Try again.
spike383 wrote:also maybe some of you younger ppl heard of it. specialy in japan parents used to raise their sons as girls,that was done to keep them from joining the army a few hundred years ago.
That's a load of crap.
spike383 wrote:they did dress themself and live as a girl. haku himself says hes a boy, kakashi is no idiot he did notice it too.
HA HA HA HA HAAA!!! Very funny. You just set yourself up to be disproved with one point:

Haku also claimed to be a tracker ninja, but that doesn't mean she was one. Kakashi sure took the bait on that one though. What a sucker!
spike383 wrote:about the flashback; calling a small boy or a girl about the age of 10+ kid doesnt tell anything about its sex.
I know. That's the point. That the flashbacks don't confirm Haku's gender. However, it does suggest that her gender was meant to stay unconfirmed so that fans could debate it.
Syntos wrote:Haku is a boy, he says it clearly to Naruto in the forest that one day. Also, back on the 'decieve' issue. He may have told Naruto that, not knowing that he would have to fight him later on.
Nope. Before she told Naruto that she was a man, she said that they would meet again. She knew that they would have to fight because Zabuza still had to kill the bridge builder.
Syntos wrote:So he may as well let Naruto have the smug beleif that he had met some random kid, picking herbs in the forest
Uh... well that just doesn't make sense.
Seiji Sawamura wrote:Haku is a boy. no matter what you say.
Well that's just the most perfect opening statement in a debate isn't it? "What I say goes no matter what facts you have to disprove it".
Seiji Sawamura wrote:Interview with the creator a logn time ago asking if haku was a girl. he said. "He looks like one huh? no haku isn't a girl he is a boy." more discription here.
Wrong! That's a complete myth. He never said that. What you're referring to is a Shounen Jump article where some SJ office peon answered a fan letter.
Seiji Sawamura wrote:Haku (白 ?) is Zabuza Momochi's right hand man and most faithful follower.
Quoting Wickedpedia isn't going to prove anything. Wikipedia is a liberal blog run by fascists who push their own opinions as fact.
Choushin_Destroyer wrote:You didn't spend enough time researching! No, just being sarcastic. I'm a bit sleptical about the pictures of Haku where...it, for our purposes...supposedly has breasts. I think it looks more like the fold of the clothes or maybe they do exist.
I explained why they can't possibly be a fold or a droop. Check the updated first post.
Choushin_Destroyer wrote:I we ask Kishimoto-san ourselves, and see what he says. This will finalize it perhaps."Truth is not relative. It's not subjective. It may be elusive or hidden. People may wish to disregard it. But there is such thing as truth." -Errol Morris
All right! You get on that and we'll see where it goes.
Choushin_Destroyer wrote:Yeeeaaaaahh...my money's on Haku being male. I'm skeptical. The agrument in favor of feminity just seems less than fully baked to me, and more enthusiastic rather than educated.
Well, read my updated post and see if you feel the same way.

In any case, what exactly proves to you that Haku was a boy? Post these fully baked arguments for me to read.
DeathAce wrote:It is an accepted fact (though it doesn't seem widely spread) that Haku is a boy (or was, anyhow), which is why I voted male.
It's an accepted misconception.
DeathAce wrote:But since we're free to give our opinions, I might as well say this: I hated as much as y'all did when it was proclaimed he's a dude, and evenmore when he died.
I did not hate it when she told Naruto that she was a boy (man in the Japanese version) because that's why convinced me that she was really a girl. Believe it!
DeathAce wrote:Haku is indeed a MALE. You can hate it, love it, think it sucks (I did..and do), but you've gotta admit, it fits perfectly. If it was a FEMALE Haku, the first (or second) meeting between "her" and NAruto would've had a different, and less funny ending. It would've been like switching Zabuza's and his roles and listing Zabuza as being "pure as the newly fallen snow."
How so? Haku can still lie to Naruto, and he can still fall for her lie like the gullible kid that he was and he could still be freaked out about it. And that's what happened.

That adds more humor to it.
hitachiinhinata wrote:I have done some research of my own. We all know that Masashi Kishimoto likes to use names that reveal something about the characters ie, Naruto-ramen topping, Sakura-pink cherry blossom, Saru-monkey, right? Well, the name 'Haku' means 'to put on (a sword)'. Does that tell you anything?
If it does really mean that then it tells me that Haku put herself on a sword, namely Kakashi's Lightning Blade.

But I don't think the word haku does mean that. In Japanese haku means the word white.
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Re: Haku was a GIRL, not a boy!

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You're a bit too passionate about Naruto, buddy. :twitch:
Decisions to decisions are made and not bought, but I thought this wouldn't hurt a lot. I guess not.
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Re: Haku was a GIRL, not a boy!

Post by SASSZAIN »

Cookie wrote:You're a bit too passionate about Naruto, buddy. :twitch:
^this
"You dont have to be alive to make yourself relevant.And you dont have to be a good person to be a hero.You just have to know who you are and stay true to that.So Im going to keep fighting for people the only way I ever knew how"-Vriska Serket
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