Verb Discussion, ばんざい!

[Dreams]

Yeah, Rin's sentence is more gramatically correct. ^^;;
But actually, 'red hair/redhead' = 赤毛 (akage), or you could use 髪が赤い (kami ga akai).

Onnanoko ga aru akai kaminoke watashi o ira-ira shimasu

I think the problem is just that this particular example uses things we didn't go over... but I did notice that you switched the object and verb in the first clause. If you were to just say [someone] has [something], it needs to be subject-object-verb:

Onnanoko wa o-kane ga aru - The girl has money

And supposing "red hair" would replace "o-kane" (money), except that the grammar for "red hair" works differently.

There's a couple different patterns for describing things, especially people, outside the normal realm of adjectives and basic grammar... I don't know if I can explain this very well, but I'll try. Certain words can be connected with 'ga' to create descriptive phrases, like the one for 'redhead' above (kami ga akai). It works, like I said, especially with describing people:

atama ga ii = smart (lit. "head is good")
se ga takai = tall (lit. "back is high")

But it can also work with weather and other descriptions...

New York wa tenki ga warui desu. = The weather in New York is bad / New York has bad weather.

This is also the same pattern as:
[noun] ga suki = I like [noun]
[noun] ga daisuki = I love [noun]
[noun] ga kirai = I don't like [noun]
[noun] ga iya = I hate [noun]

etc.

Also!
If you want to say you are good or bad at something, you can use tokui (good) or nigate (bad) the same way:
Watashi wa Chousengo ga nigate desu - I'm terrible at Korean / My Korean skills suck. Etc.

The problem is that some of these are just set phrases, so turning the words around may sound strange. In addition, nouns like the other word for 'redhead' (akage) can be attached to other nouns with 'no' to become descriptive:

Akage no onnanoko = A girl with red hair / A redheaded girl

Those patterns might be a little harder to use, because they have limitations... but no obvious limitations. You know what I mean? There's no defining line that says, "You cannot use [this word] in this pattern"... it's going to be more of something you pick up on as you go along with the language. There are a lot of idiomatic expressions with this usage.

And... Rin brought up the ~te iru form, which is pretty important.

The ~te iru form is made by putting a verb into its past plain positive form, and then switching the final 'a' to 'e'... and then adding 'iru', of course. Taberu -> tabeta -> tabete iru. / Matsu -> matta -> matte iru.

This form is used for:
1. Habitual actions - things you do every day, every week, what you do for a living, etc.
Watashi wa giga o egaite iru - I draw cartoons (for a living)
Maiban bangohan o tabete iru - I eat dinner every evening.
2. Continuous/ongoing actions - something you're doing and have been doing...
Nani o shite iru ka? - What are you doing?
Terebi o mite iru - Watching TV (as I have been for a while)
3. States resulting from actions... easier to show than explain.
Kare wa kekkon shite iru - He is married.
Ima kare wa shinde iru - Now, he is dead.
4. And some verbs are just used more naturally/frequently in this form:
motsu (to hold, carry) -> motte iru
sumu (to live [somewhere]) -> sunde iru
shiru (to know) -> shitte iru

*To make it negative, simply make iru -> inai or imasen (polite)
*Da/desu, aru, and iru itself have no ~te iru form.
*This form is frequently shortened to ~te'ru in its informal form. (Like 'ai shiteru' = I love you)

So...

The girl with the red hair is annoying me.
Akage no onnanoko wa watashi o ira-ira shite imasu.

[Karin Rengu]

aw man did I mess up! I guess I still need more practice before I start making sentences XD

[Dreams]

There are a lot of patterns and rules to learn in Japanese - don't feel bad!
You wrote a better sentence than I could make in my first two weeks.
It's just going to take some time and studying and practice...

[Karin Rengu]

Yea and I don't really have time either. But I really do want to learn this!

[Karin Rengu]

I have a "few" more questions.

1.) When there are verbs like 'ryouri suru' and 'kunren suru' the 2 words are always side by side in the sentence right? Like, ryouri and suru wouldn't be separated by a particle in any case or anything like that.

2.) aru and iru, just want to make sure I'm using them right (some examples just to clarify their use):
"Watashi wa neko o iru" (I have a cat) It's not watashi no right? because that would be my cat?
"Watashi wa tabemono o aru" (I have food)
Also, I'm not sure if I asked this before or not but do aru and iru conjugate normally? (I'm asking because the german verb for 'to have' is irregular. why I'm associating the 2 languages I have no idea XD)

3.) I found this word in my dictionary for nauseated "hakike ga suru" and it's listed as an adjective. Is that right? The suru makes it sound like a verb to me but I'm a beginner.

4.)Is there any other informal ways for a girl to say "I" other than 'atashi'? It doesn't really seem fair that we only have one other way when guys have a lot (like 'ore' and 'boku') XD maybe I'm just complaining.

5.) Since I'm new to the adjectives I want to know if this sentence is right.
"Watashi wa byouki no desu mon" 'I am sick' (I put the 'mon' there as a way to make it sound like I'm complaining like I'm a kid- I don't even know if that's right. But 'sick' in my dictionary is an adjective and it's written byouki (no) so I wasn't sure if it should be 'byouki no' or 'byouki o' in a sentence.

6.) Spacing in Japanese sentences are rare right? They usually just string the characters together? And there's nothing like commas or periods or colons etc. right?

7.) Do you have a link to a site where I can find a list of the combination characters for hiragana and katakana (like cho, sho, kyo etc.) because I have a list of the regular ones just not the combinations.

[Dreams]

1.) When there are verbs like 'ryouri suru' and 'kunren suru' the 2 words are always side by side in the sentence right? Like, ryouri and suru wouldn't be separated by a particle in any case or anything like that.

No, those verbs wouldn't be broken up by a particle. You might as well consider them one word.

2.) aru and iru, just want to make sure I'm using them right (some examples just to clarify their use):
"Watashi wa neko o iru" (I have a cat) It's not watashi no right? because that would be my cat?
"Watashi wa tabemono o aru" (I have food)
Also, I'm not sure if I asked this before or not but do aru and iru conjugate normally? (I'm asking because the german verb for 'to have' is irregular. why I'm associating the 2 languages I have no idea XD)

Right, you've got the general idea. Iru = animate things; aru = inanimate things.
And 'watashi no' would indeed be 'my'; 'watashi no neko' = 'my cat'.
But aru and iru don't use the particle 'o'. They use 'ga' or 'ni', depending on whether you're talking about placement or possession.

Watashi wa neko ga iru = I have a cat
Tabemono ga aru = There's food/I have food

The general patterns go:

[noun] wa [place] ni aru/iru = [noun] is in/at [place] - used when the noun is something definite ('the cat', 'the store')
Neko wa niwa ni iru = The cat is in the garden

[place] ni [noun] ga aru/iru = [noun] is in/at [place] - used when noun is abstract ('a cat', 'a store')
Niwa ni neko ga iru = There's a cat in the garden

[subject] wa [object] ga aru/iru = [subject] has [object]
Watashi wa o-kane ga aru = I have money

Iru is your standard -ru verb and follows all the rules.
Aru has some irregular forms, though. I'm pretty sure I pointed those out as I went along.
For instance, its plain negative form is 'nai', and some other forms are derived from that... past plain negative becomes 'nakatta', its negative conjunctive form becomes 'nakute'.

I can make a chart of irregular verbs for you later.

3.) I found this word in my dictionary for nauseated "hakike ga suru" and it's listed as an adjective. Is that right? The suru makes it sound like a verb to me but I'm a beginner.

It fits into that category I was teaching you about earlier - personal description, etc. Remember the discussion about the word "redhead"? A lot of adjectives can be formed that way, usually about people, but sometimes about the weather or places. They can also be used as verbs, so to speak... like, states or conditions. And it's just a matter of learning what's most appropriate to say. But they get formed with [noun] ga [adj/verb], or something along those lines:

atama ga ii = smart (lit. "head is/has good")
nodo ga kawaku = thirsty (lit. "throat is/gets dry")

4.)Is there any other informal ways for a girl to say "I" other than 'atashi'? It doesn't really seem fair that we only have one other way when guys have a lot (like 'ore' and 'boku') XD maybe I'm just complaining.

Well, guys really only have 'boku' and 'ore'. (And I suppose cranky old guys can use 'washi'.)
Girls also have 'atai' (or 'ate' when slurred).
I would say that beneath 'watashi' (or the super polite 'watakushi'), 'atashi' is the equivalent of 'boku'.
And then 'atai' is the equivalent of 'ore', which are both kind of arrogant/rude/etc.
Girls are also increasingly using 'boku', which sounds a bit tomboyish but cute.

My personal favorite set of words to use is 'kocchi' for 'I/me', and 'socchi' for 'you'.
The words are also slurred, informal versions of 'kochira' (this way) and 'sochira' (that way).

5.) Since I'm new to the adjectives I want to know if this sentence is right.
"Watashi wa byouki no desu mon" 'I am sick' (I put the 'mon' there as a way to make it sound like I'm complaining like I'm a kid- I don't even know if that's right. But 'sick' in my dictionary is an adjective and it's written byouki (no) so I wasn't sure if it should be 'byouki no' or 'byouki o' in a sentence.

Haha, cute use of 'mon'. ^^
With adjectives that use 'no', treat them like 'na' adjectives in standard use.
When putting them right before a noun, keep the 'no' on it (byouki no hito = sick person).
When using them right before da/desu, drop the 'no' (watashi wa byouki da = I'm sick).

And I'd be remiss if I didn't show you a better way to say "I'm sick" - "kibun ga warui" (lit. 'feeling [is] bad')
Watashi wa kibun ga warui desu mon! = I (really do) feel sick!

6.) Spacing in Japanese sentences are rare right? They usually just string the characters together? And there's nothing like commas or periods or colons etc. right?

Japanese has all the punctuation we use and more. I suppose it's safe to say they just don't use it as often as we do. And no, they don't put spaces between words or anything, unless there's a real need to draw attention to something, perhaps.

Punctuation:

。"maru", the period. Ends a sentence.
、"ten", the big swishy comma. Same usage as English. Sometimes they also use the little curvy English comma.
・ "nakaten", used between words or phrases to connect them but give reading ease. Like: カリン・レング = Karin Rengu.
― "nakasen", used like the dash in English.
・・・ "tensen", used like our ellipsis. I adore the tensen because it's up in the middle of the line instead of at the bottom.
「」"kagikakko", used like our quotation marks. But, they also sometimes use English quotation marks.
『』"futaekagi", used for quotations inside quotations.
〃 "in'youfu", another style of quotation marks - a little bigger and swooshier than ours.
（）"kakko", used like our parentheses.
《》this one...
【】...and this one are also parentheses/brackets. Don't know what they're called though.
～ "namigata", used to indicate a range, like "from... to."

There are some of them I can't figure out how to write with my IME. For instance, there are regular double parentheses (like the double quotation mark one) which are used for parentheses inside parentheses. There's also a set of curved lines that look just like the parentheses, but go the opposite direction (one would go on top of a symbol, and the other on the bottom) - this is used to mark off information or words, etc.

The "wakiten" also looks like a comma placed alongside Japanese words/phrases. This is a way to italicize or highlight certain things. There's also the "wakisen", which essentially has the same use but just looks like underlining.

And, of course, the exclamation point and the question mark are used.

7.) Do you have a link to a site where I can find a list of the combination characters for hiragana and katakana (like cho, sho, kyo etc.) because I have a list of the regular ones just not the combinations.

This is a good site: http://www.manchaca.com/~sradowski/japa ... index.html
Except they don't label the pronounciation mutations...

S + I = SHI -> し シ
T + I = CHI -> ち チ
T + U = TSU -> つ ツ
H + U = FU -> ふ フ

Z + I = JI -> じ ジ
D + I = JI -> ぢ ヂ
D + U = ZU -> づ ヅ

(I can tell you how to use the two different JIs and ZUs if you want.)

All S + Y sounds become 'SH'... like S + YA = SHA, etc.
And Z + Y makes the J sound. Z + YA is actually 'JA', etc.

The problem is, it all depends on how you choose to romanize. I think it's a smarter route to romanize how it actually sounds when spoken, but some people choose to write it according to the kana. So instead of writing 'sha', they'll write 'sya'.

[Karin Rengu]

And then 'atai' is the equivalent of 'ore', which are both kind of arrogant/rude/etc.
I didn't know 'ore' was arrogant!

Girls are also increasingly using 'boku', which sounds a bit tomboyish but cute.
Great news for me because I'm a tomboy ^_^ but for the foreign exchange student I think I'll stick with 'watakushi' for now (I didn't know it was formal, thanks!)

Thanks for the punctuation lesson! I guess I never noticed them when I look through my naruto book (I managed to get my hands on a manga of the movie in kanji!)

S + I = SHI -> し シ
T + I = CHI -> ち チ
T + U = TSU -> つ ツ
H + U = FU -> ふ フ

Z + I = JI -> じ ジ
D + I = JI -> ぢ ヂ
D + U = ZU -> づ ヅ

Is this how they're written? I have a little chart but it doesn't write them like that. Or are those both the hiragana and katakana characters together?

[Dreams]

Yeah, I would say 'ore' is a bit on the arrogant side - I suppose the term 'ore-sama' is the truly haughty one. (But I love when characters use it in anime!) I would suggest just sticking with 'watashi' around the foreign exchange student, though. My penpals and I always used 'watashi' - I think 'watakushi' would sound far too formal... I could hear businessmen who are meeting for the first time using the term, or something like that, but you won't need to use it.

Yeah, sorry for the confusion. The first character is hiragana, the second is katakana.
SHI in hiragana: し
SHI in katakana: シ

And so on.

[Karin Rengu]

I see what you mean now. I didn't realize it until after I printed the charts though-they say "shi" is "si" and I'm guessing it's "sha" as "siya" It really does suck

[Karin Rengu]

Ok, I have been working on my Japanese quite a bit in the past month and during a search to learn more I found these conjugations.

arukeru 'I can walk'
arukitai 'I want to walk'
So, what I'm wondering is are these always the endings I use? This was the only example of them.

And, I'm not sure if I've asked this before but how do you conjugate 'ai' (to love)?

[Dreams]

"Ai" is the noun "love". The corresponding verb is "ai suru", so you would conjugate "suru" however you need to.

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There are two patterns to use to mean "I can [verb]":

[present plain verb] koto ga dekiru (the polite form of dekiru -> dekimasu)
Ex) Nihongo de yomu koto ga dekiru = I can read (in) Japanese.

The other form is the one you have there, it uses an ending on the verb:
RU verbs: change the ~ru into ~rareru (or more commonly now, the shortened form ~reru)
U verbs: change the ~u into ~eru

Aruku -> arukeru = I can walk
Taberu -> taberareru/tabereru = I can eat

The ~reru/eru ending works like any RU verb for changing forms:
Aruketa = I was able to walk
Arukenai = I'm not able to walk

One last note: if using the second form (~reru/eru), 'suru' changes into 'dekiru'.
ie) Ai suru -> ai dekiru (I'm able to love)

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The pattern for wanting to do something is to either add ~tai or ~itai to the end:
With RU verbs, replace ~ru with ~tai (taberu -> tabetai)
With U verbs, replace ~u with ~itai (aruku -> arukitai)
To make it polite (I originally wrote "police" lmao), add "desu" after the verb.

This ~tai verb ending conjugates like an I adjective:
Arukitakunai = I don't want to walk
Arukitakunakatta = I didn't want to walk

For wanting things, there's a different pattern:
[noun] ga hoshii (desu)
Ringo ga hoshii da = I want an apple

Etc

[Karin Rengu]

Ok! Thanks! ^_^

[Karin Rengu]

Ok, in German class we learned about a group of verbs called modals. They included should, would, could, like, want, and must. So, after learning how to can, able, and want, I feel that I should learn how to make these other verbs forms. You know, like should walk, must walk. Showing me all of these would probably take a while so you can do it over time if you want. Or not at all. Thanks ^_^

[Dreams]

I haven't the time to go through them right now, but I'll come back on and do it. Hopefully over the weekend, but my weekends are usually busy. Let me see...

I can teach you intentions (should) for first person and third person...
I can teach you must and must not, but they're a little tricky.
There's not really a form for "would", unless you're talking about giving advice, and I can teach you that...
"Like" in verb form? Can you post an example?

Although, that reminds me. I can teach you "no you ni" if you haven't learned it already.

There's soooo much we could go over yet. It's mind boggling.

[Karin Rengu]

Like as in 'I would like to walk'. I figured there would be a lot but thanks for trying to find the time.
And I haven't learned 'no you ni' yet.

[Dreams]

Oh, I see. Well, "like" as in, "I would like to [verb]" is covered by the ~tai ending. You can also use a verb in its ~te form plus hoshii in some instances, but you can use ~tai to be on the safe side. ~tai can cover "I want, I'd like (to), I wish", etc.

When intending to do something, you can either use "~you/ou to omou (OR omotte iru)", or "tsumori". The first form uses the plain suggestive verb form. I have no idea if you know that, nor do I remember if I taught it.

The polite suggestive form is made by putting ~masu -> ~mashou.
Tabemashou! -> Let's eat!

The plain suggestive form is made by replacing RU with YOU, or U with OU.
Tabeyou! -> Let's eat!
Odorou! -> We should dance!

So, then adding ~to omou after this means that you're thinking about doing something. ~omotte iru means that you've been considering doing this for a while.

Mou sukoshi matou to omou = I think I'll wait a little longer
Nippon e ikou to omotte iru = I'm thinking about going to Japan

"Tsumori" has more of a definite and/or immediate ring to it. It's followed by da/desu, and simply comes after the verb that one intends/intended to do. The verb defines past, present, negative, etc.

Nippon e iku tsumori da = I intend to go to Japan
Kyonen Nippon e itta tsumori da = I meant to go to Japan last year

You can report third-person intentions the same way, but should really only do it if it's fact. Like, if the person has stated they're going to do something, and you repeat it. Otherwise, you might want to say, "I think [she/he] wants to..." as to not offend somebody.

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"Must" and "must not" are on those verb charts I posted, so if you have questions about them after looking over them, let me know.

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There's no real form for "would". It really just depends on how you translate things. For instance, "I would like..." would still be ~tai or hoshii. "I would eat this, but..." would just be, "Kono o taberu ga...". If you said something like, "If I were you, I would..." it'd just be, "Mou watashi ga anata dattara, [whatever] verb and/or deshou" etc.

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"No you ni" is a way of saying "like". It's also used as "no you na" when it comes before nouns.

[A] no you na = A like [A]
[A] no you ni (verb) = (verb) like [A]

Neko no you na katachi = A shape like a cat
Kaze no you ni hashiru = Run like the wind