does god really exist?

[Lucia Skyfire]

I had lots to say, but for some reason, I can't remember. I don't know why, but I can't remember any of it. Thats why Ive been .

[Red]

Red; you are essentially telling me that creation is correct and that by creation I have one more rib than a woman... okay that's a bit extreme, and I do see your point, that religion still has a purpose to may people, however, something else to understand is that religon was first created to act as a filler for things we did not know, it then became a method of control.

People needed an explination for how this world was created, and WHY we exist. t was easier to say "We exist to please God, and we exist becasue he created us tp please him." ((And yes, from that period it would be a 'him'... sorry women, but you weren't all that respeced in those times...))

Science has come up with some crackpot theories as well (The big bang for one...) however nw there are new theories emerging that are beginning to become mroe accepted, and those are the theories of Quantum Physics. In quantum physics you look at things, not as set things but tendencies and possiblites, meaning that in all likelyhood, this earth, this universe, do NOT exist independently of our input, and that our physical bodies are actualy representations of mental images from ourselves and those around us, therefore it could be said, that the universe has existed for an infinite ammount of time before, and after, you existed, as simply a plane of consiousness with enough substance to form into soild tendancies that we call planets, stars, moons, and ourselves. And that consiousness is our own, and everyone is linked togeather through this universal consiousness, and in fact, every particle has another particle exactly like it somewhere else in this universe, meaning that we are in fact, linked both physicaly and mentaly to each otehr.

as to the question of "Why" we exist, we try to find a reason for this however the most sound reason I cna think of right now, and I change my standing on this often, as I think about it alot, is that tehre simply is no right answer. something as, if you will excuse the word stupid, as "to please God" is meaningless, and something complicated that would be determined by science is also stupid, we exist simply to better ourselves and to exist is to be esistant, and nothing more.

lol that was very hard to understand. But if u ask me, its like a botomless pit; how u could imagine everything was formed.. and why we exist. Now we should never question how religion came about, whether it be a figment of our imagination, or as a means of answering life's most bizarre questions. but understand the fact that science is beginning to accept religion. If you still have not read the link that proves the existance of god, which i am sure is the reason this thread exist, then please do so. (look at my signature)

Anyway, maybe sometimes we need to expand our viewpoints, and not just accept what everyone else accepts. Maybe the question really is, why should God NOT exist. understand that the universe is very very large, and very very complex. the fact itself that earth exists in its very form, is utterly amazing. if you would look around you at what we call "life" you will begin to understand that the earth was no "accident"

An accident would not be able to create something we all share: beauty and emotions (seems that a sun-set is always breath taking). If everything were to steadily "build-up" and then at some time in eternity, with a stroke of chance and possibility, somehow, everything fell into place and "ta - da" we existed, then we are denying existance in itself.

it is so much easier to believe that we are created by God. and as you take one step towards that direction, maybe the things u denied at first, will all come together. but unfortunately we all decide to be logical, foolishly in what everybody in general believes. we can try to comprehend the universe and what it holds, but we will simply go round in circles forever.

Let me add that it is impossible to please God(in the way everyone else thinks they should). Accepting and being accepted by God, does not require a tad bit of ur strength. I guess thats why he is God, and you are a human. He is the only God that actually wants to be a God for all of us. instead of all of us having to be something for our god. Knowing this is the only way you can please God.

[Raoul Duke]

An accident would not be able to create something we all share: beauty and emotions (seems that a sun-set is always breath taking). If everything were to steadily "build-up" and then at some time in eternity, with a stroke of chance and possibility, somehow, everything fell into place and "ta - da" we existed, then we are denying existance in itself.

I think that is silly.
Umm... "ta - da" God created us all in 6 days...or.. taaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa - daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa, lifeforms evolved over millions of years... lol

Ok, so you say nothing is an accident. Why does God create famine? Why can't he make enough food for everybody? [moral question not literal! ]

it is so much easier to believe that we are created by God. and as you take one step towards that direction, maybe the things u denied at first, will all come together. but unfortunately we all decide to be logical, foolishly in what everybody in general believes. we can try to comprehend the universe and what it holds, but we will simply go round in circles forever.

So...we should stop asking questions, remain ignorant; attribute/prescribe everything to God, because it is waaaayyyyy easy if he's responsible for everything, as opposed to a logically solid answer.

Let me add that it is impossible to please God(in the way everyone else thinks they should). Accepting and being accepted by God, does not require a tad bit of ur strength. I guess thats why he is God, and you are a human. He is the only God that actually wants to be a God for all of us. instead of all of us having to be something for our god. Knowing this is the only way you can please God.

Will he be the God for muslims? What about black people?

[Red]

I think that is silly.
Umm... "ta - da" God created us all in 6 days...or.. taaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa - daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa, lifeforms evolved over millions of years... lol

Ok, so you say nothing is an accident. Why does God create famine? Why can't he make enough food for everybody? [moral question not literal! ]

lol. i can understand where you are going. i guess its a matter of opinion. then again, Lets not just say "Ta da, god created everything in 6 days." or "life forms over a million years"
both sounds silly, its up to us to determine which is more "sound". Science has absolutely no evidence of how lifeform develops, so what does science do, throw in the word BILLIONS, to make it sound that its possible, over such a long time that people could actually devlop from apes! LEts be fair now

Lets look at both "theories" as equal, and fair, and judge from there. lets not be biased just coz God is "almighthy" and can do anything, and then coming up with a conclusion that God definitely exists. That would be wrong.

But understand that life doesn't form over a million years. Nothing in this world "upgradeS" but as you can see downgrades. every system in this world is based on each other. if one member of a system is missing, the whole system will collapse. and each member of the system, is so delicate and complicated in itself, but still useless without its supporting members. It is very hard to say that these lifeless forms, atoms or "cells" can come together, over a billion years, and slowly develop and form something that is even more complicated, something that mankind struggles to explain, yet in a very absurd way.

So...we should stop asking questions, remain ignorant; attribute/prescribe everything to God, because it is waaaayyyyy easy if he's responsible for everything, as opposed to a logically solid answer.

People say that we use God as an 'excuse' to satisfy the unknown, or what we do not know, to fill in the empty void for everything we do not understand.
But so does science. There are basically so many theories out there that support one another, so much so like an empire. its really really hard to imagine, how the FIRST theory came about, and how it was accepted. of course no body would ever believe it sounded logical.. at first.
Science is basically man's own creation, in trying to understand how God works, God creates and designs everything in a way that, it is so natural, but yet supernatural (for example, how does our heart beat non-stop our whole life? yes though science can explain that, but isn't it supernatural in a sense?)

and then men built science upon science, its really like coming at life in another angle, its not Absolute, in a sense that it is the definite way of looking at things. Man are coming up with even more bizzare theories, or it only sounds bizzare due to the fact that we have already established an angle of science. but im pretty sure if we actually shift everything, and build everything on 1 bizzare theory, we would have a whole new "science" Just becuase there is science to explain how everything works "naturally", doesn't mean God doesn't exist. science has only been able to prove the existance of God (and indeed science has).
Science has never tried to prove that god doesn't exist. Why? Because everybody assumes that with an explantion on how God created everything, it means theres no creator.
For everything that is so wonderfully complicated and beautiful, it IS justifiable to say that there was a creator. just like how a comptuer program didnt just randomly occur out of those few "letters" coming together in a random code and then forming what we call windows. (this is such a weak illustration btw)
ok, lets say with such an impossible chance, that windows did form out of random codes. lets then say windows started to devlop, from windows 1995 all the way to windows xp. well. get the picture?

If we still hold on to the evolution theory, it really means we don't understand how complicated life on earth is, and how everything is so perfectly situated on one another, dependant on one another. Difficult to imagine how it was an "accident"

Of course you have to understand that, God does not create famine. God ain't evil, the devil is. The devil creates famine. If man didn't fall and inevitably bring about the curse, the earth would still have enough food for everyone for a billion years.

Science theories are basically conclusions on things we don't understand things. And by that, we find the most logical way it would seem that such a thing could function, and determine it. Such is so, for how sceintist would determine existance of God, or existance of the ENTIRE universe through a random collision of atoms. Conclusions HAS been made.

Will he be the God for muslims? What about black people?

I am very sure God would. Everyone originated from God, but we ourselves brought about divisions, created our own Gods, and now we ask whether this God is a God for all. Yes he is.

I understand that my explanation is kind of weak, but as I agree with your explanations to a certain extent, i hope you will try to accept my explanations.

if you still have not read the article in my link, please do so. it will enlighten you.

[Raoul Duke]

"However, everything, including this booklet, has a reasonable limit."

There was no reasonable limit to the sillyness of that "booklet". I read the whole link. SHUT UP! I have nothing else to do!

[Mai]

Uhm, Red if you feel so...what's the word I'm looking for... ..If you feel so, obligated to argue then could you just stop repeated the same things over and over and oooooover.

It's just hurting my eyes reading all of that when it's pratically the same to what you said before.

[Red]

Uhm, Red if you feel so...what's the word I'm looking for... Think..If you feel so, obligated to argue then could you just stop repeated the same things over and over and oooooover.

It's just hurting my eyes reading all of that when it's pratically the same to what you said before.

lol, well maybe i am. at least i got my point across to you.
I am basically returning what you guys were asking, or threw at me.
maybe if you have any doubts, you could instead point out the place where you are unsure , and post a reply according to what i have said, instead of making a comment on what i said.

"However, everything, including this booklet, has a reasonable limit."

There was no reasonable limit to the sillyness of that "booklet". I read the whole link. SHUT UP! I have nothing else to do

i'm glad you read it. I also see you have highlighted
a sentence from that booklet very cleverly (out of context i am afraid).. now tell me, besides finding it "silly". whether you have anything to say on the information it provided, compared to what you previously learned from an even more "silly" theory of evolution.

[Mai]

you could instead point out the place where you are unsure

Dude, I was simply asking what Einstein meant..I didn't want the whole damn bible summarized for me.

[Atomosk]

let's start a new debate. here's my question to throw out. i'll post my opinion after y'all start talking.

If God loves us and wants us to be safe, why do bad things still happen to good people?

[Raoul Duke]

1. He doesn't exist (If he did he's incompetant, irrelevant, or just a dick.)



If there is some creator, i do not think it has anything to do with us. we decide whats right or wrong and it doesnt and i'm repeating myself (indicated by the lack of puntuation and capital letters~laziness)

[Mai]

Hmmm..well god is supposed to treat good hearted people the same as he would to the evil bastards..(right?)

So...yea...uhm..That's all I got.

[Red]

we are so quick to jump to conclusion. we see God as bad, rather than good. the reason why people would not turn their beliefs is probably because they are unable to see who God really is. i can symphatise with such people. who would bother to dedicate their life to something or someone who doesn't care or do anything good for you. thats where the common phrase comes about, 'i don't need god' if you think god is like that you are wrong.

then again, if you refuse to accept that God exist, or that if he does, he is an "[censored]" then its best u do not even say that because, if God exist, its time we turn from our ways instead of blindly going against a wall. No one in life ever knows their purpose.. hell, the word purpose has no meaning for all aethist. no one has a solid understanding on why they are on earth. they just live their lives, until they die.. what happens next?

if you think God has total control on this whole earth, to prevent bad things from happening, you are wrong again. blame it on ur fore father adam, who allowed things such as thirst, hunger, pain and sorrow to come into the world.

Bad things does happen to good people. it is also best not to classify people as bad or good in God's eyes. in God's eyes, all have sinned, all are sinners. we may think some people are "good" but no one really is. well then again, there are those with the good heart, that is a bit different. even if we have no good deeds, but we have a heart for God, God does favour us.

the only way we can ever be 'acceptable' to god, is through Jesus' work on the cross, and to believe in him.. not our good deeds. no amount of good deeds can save us, or bring us to heaven. isn't that good news? it is not very difficult to go to heaven after all. Yet i can't help but wonder why, people still avoid the solution to all things, and continue to live their blind lives.
even the facts are in, its time to make the right choice.

[kyo83]

Hi guys, I apologise for the long wait. I’ve been busy these days. Do not thing that I’m trying to run away… keke… I’m still not done with refuting Darwinism, so please pardon me for backtracking.

First of all, I welcome Red for joining us in this discussion. I’m so glad that somebody is willing to take up the responsibility of defending the reality of God.

As for J. Kudo’s question regarding the worshipping of Jesus, I’ll come to that once I’m done with this.

There are billions more experts that think the idea of Christian "God" is absurd, lol.

What country do you live in?

I live in Singapore. My assertion of countries that persecute Christians are those of the communist regime. (I don’t think I need to spell out the names.) It’s amazing to hear atheist of declaring, “religions are the cause of troubles these days” when I always get to hear how communist regime torture people for not recanting Jesus. That’s really a food for thought. It goes to show that atheists who declare this, had never seriously done a thorough check or they simply ignore the problem. By the way, when you claim that there are “billion more experts”, please show me the quotes of the billions expert that you are referring to. Then again even if there are a billions, I doubt their education for since many top scientists rejected evolution as a mere myth. I’ll will go through them later.

To J. Kudo:

I’m very glad that you’ve decided to search on quotes that people believe there is no God. If you believe that they are right. Good for you, but as far as I’m concern, I want facts, evidence and not just some philosophical ideas. (You seems to be the person who reminded me this in the first place.) I’ll only point some out to refute, as for the others I’ll just say that they may have their point of view.

Not only does God play dice, but... he sometimes throws them where they cannot be seen.
- Stephen W. Hawking

Einstein said, “God doesn’t play dice.” He was right. God plays scrabble.
- Philip Gold

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind.
- Albert Einstein, in The New Convergence

I’m not quite sure why you point this out. I’ve never said that my faith is blind. I prove them with my personal experience and credible scientific evidence from various experts.


Atheists claim that we are created from some random atoms, that we do not have any purpose or reason for being alive. They claim that life is just like itself and at the end of life, we will just rot away.

If what they claim is true, what’s the point of living? What is there to life? We might as well die once we are born, for why suffer for the next 70-80 years meaninglessly?

Consider the words of Sir John Templeton.

“Would it be strange if a universe without purpose accidentally created humans who are so obsessed with purpose?”

Take some time to ponder this. Is it possible that the Earth’s location, it’s size, is composition, it’s structure, it’s atmosphere, it’s temperature, it’s internal dynamics, and many of its intricate cycles that are so crucial and essential to life like – the carbon cycle, the oxygen cycle, the nitrogen cycle, the phosphorous cycle, etc. which are so exquisitely and precariously balanced to allow the inhabitants of planet Earth to be just a mere coincidence, a mere act of random mutation of amino acids? You really needs more faith to believe in evolution than to believe in a Intelligent Designer.

More and more scientists have come to a conclusion that evolution theory is just a myth with no credible evidence that it happen.

“Scientists who utterly reject evolution may be one of our fastest growing controversial minorities… Many of the scientists supporting this position held impressive credentials in science.”
- Larry Hatfield in Science Digest

In fact some time ago when PBC broadcast a seven-part series titled Evolution, claiming that “all known scientific evidence supports [Darwinism] evolution” as does “virtually every reputable scientist in the world”. A group of about one hundred scientists and experts of different fields-biologists, chemists, zoologists, organic chemists, geologists, etc… All of them had their doctorates from prestigious universities such as Cambridge, Stanford, Correl, Princeton, Yale, Berkeley, Chicago, etc… came together to published a two-page advertisement under the title: “A Scientific Dissent from Darwinism”. They want to let the whole world know their point of view.

“We are skeptical of claims for the ability of random mutation and natural selection to account for the complexity of life. Careful examination of the evidence for Darwinian theory should be encourage”
-“A Scientific Dissent from Darwinism”. A two-page advertisement,
The Weekly Standard (October 1, 2001)

These neither are not religious radicals nor are they narrow-minded fundamentalists. These are in fact well respected, world class scientists like, Nobel nominee Henry F. Schaefer, the third most cited scientist in the world; James Tour of Rice University’s center for Nanoscale science and Technology; and Fred Figworth, professor of cellular and molecular physiology at Yale Graduate School.

In fact there was also a detailed 151-page critique that claims that the series “failed to present accurately and fairly the scientific problems with the evidence for Darwinian evolution.”

Agnostic molecular biologist, Michael Denton in his book, Evolution: A Theory in Crisis, points out that, “[Evolutionary theory] is still, as it was in Darwin’s time, a highly speculative hypothesis entirely without direct factual support and very far from that self-evident axiom some of its more aggressive advocates would have us believe.”

Many other experts too agree that the Darwinian evolutionary theory is just a myth the they want to believe so that they can put an intelligent designer out of the picture. Consider their points:

“Is it possible that the laws of nature are such that life is possible? Might this not be an important clue to the nature and destiny of humanity?”
- Alister McGrath, in his 3-volume series “A Scientific Theology”

“It is quite easy to understand why so many scientists have changed their minds in the past thirty years agreeing that the universe cannot reasonably be explained as a cosmic accident. Evidence for an intelligent designer becomes more compelling the more we understand about our carefully crafted habitat.”
- Walter Bradley, co-author of The Mystery of Life’s Origin.

In fact former professor of theoretical physics of university of Adelaide, who was once skeptical, now conclude that, “Through my scientific work I have come to believe more and more strongly tat the physical universe is put together with an ingenuity so astonishing that I cannot accept it merely as a brute fact. I cannot believe that our existence in this universe is a mere quirk of fate, an accident of history, and incident blip in the great cosmic drama.”
- Paul Davies in the Mind of God

Sir Fred Hoyle put it this way, “ I do not believe that any scientists who examined the evidence would fail to draw the inference that the laws of nuclear physics have been deliberately designed with regard to the consequences they produce inside stars.”

This observation prompted Harvard astronomy professor Owen Gingerich, senior astronomer at the Smithsonian Astrophysical Observatory to comment: “Fred Hoyle and I differ on lots of questions, but on this we agree: a common sense and satisfying interpretation of our world suggests the designing hand of a superintelligence.” (Owen Gingerich, “Dare a Scientist Believe in Design?” in John M.Templeton’s Evidence of Purpose.)

Oxford-educated John Leslie, in his eye-opening 1989 book, Universes, said that if ours is the only universe- and there is no scientific data proving ay other exists- then th fine tuning is “genuine evidence… that God Is real.”

In the New Story of Science, Robert Augros and George Stancin, said that, “A universe aiming at the production of man implies that a mind directing it. Though man is not at the center of the universe, he appears to be at the center of its purpose.”

John O’ Keefe earned his degree from Harvard and the University of Chicago, went on to be a renowned astronomer and pioneer in space research. The late Eugene Shoemaker called him “the godfather of astrogeology.” He was awarded many honors including, the Goddard Space Flight Center’s highest award and is credited to many breakthrough discoveries in his scientific research at NASA. It was the discoveries of astronomy that bolstered O’ Keefe’s faith in God. He concluded that,
”We are, by astronomical standards, a pampered, cosseted, cherished group of creatures, our Darwinian claim to have done it all by ourselves is as ridiculous and as charming as a baby’s brave efforts to stand on its feet and refuse his mother’s hand. If the universe had not been made with the most exacting precision we could never have come into existence. It is my view that these circumstances indicate the universe was created for man to live in.”(John O’ Keefe, “The Theological Impact of the New Cosmology, in Robert Jastrow, God and Astronomers, 118).

Regarding the fossil record of Darwin’s, David M. Ramp the curator of the Field Museum of National History in Chicago, said that, “We are now about one hundred and twenty years after Darwin and the knowledge of the fossil record has been greatly expanded. We now have a quarter of a million fossil species, but the situation hasn’t change much… We have even fewer example of evolutionary transition than we had in Darwin’s time.”(David M. Ramp, “Conflicts between Darwin and Paleontology”, Bulletin, Field Museum of Natural History, January 1979.), speaking about Darwin’s claim that future discoveries of fossils would vindicate his theory, which till date still have not.

Consider the words of Werner von Braun, the father of space science:
“The vast mysteries of the universe should only confirm our belief in the certainty of a Creator. I find it as difficult to understand a scientist who does not acknowledge the presence of a superior rationality behind the existence of the universe as it is to comprehend a theologian who would deny the advances of scince.”

I’m confused as to why J. Kudo would list out Einstein’s quotes about faith without science is blind. I would like to ask this, since when did I base my faith on just mere faith? Haven’t I pointed out that may scientists have lots of evidence that evolution just isn’t possible and that all evidence points so clearly towards an intelligent designer? Consider the words of another expert: “Science and religion… are friends, not foes, in the common quest for knowledge. Some people may find this surprising, for there’s a feeling throughout our society that religious belief is outdated or downright impossible, in a scientific age. I don’t agree. In fact, I’d go so far to say that if people in this so-called “scientific age” knew a bit more about science than many of them really actually do, they’d find it easier to share my view.”(John Polkinghorne, a physicist who went on to be a theologian after find God in Physics.)

Allan Rex Sandage, the greatest observational cosmologist in the world. He deciphered the secrets of the stars, plumbed the mysteries of quasars, revealed the use of global clusters, pinpointed the distances of remote galaxies and quantified the universe’s expansion through his work at the Mount Wilson and Palomar Observatories. The New York Times dubbed him the “Grand Old Man of Cosmology”. He was at a 1985 conference on science and religion. It seems so certain for everybody who he would side. Surely he would side with the atheistic scientists, however, instead sitting with the atheists, he took seat with the theists! Those who believe in an intelligent designer.
The Big Bang, he told the shock audience, was a supernatural event that cannot be explained within the realm of physics. Science had taken us to the First Event, but it can’t take us further to the First Cause. The sudden emergence of matter, space, time and energy pointed to the need for some kind of transdence. In the mist of the talk, he even confessed to be a Christian.
Sandage is not the only person who rejects evolution. Dean Kenyon, a biophysicist from San Francisco State University, who had co-authored an influential book, ”Biochemically Predestined”, states that the emergence of life might have been biochemically predestined, because of an inherent attraction between amino acids. However, Kenyon later repudiated the conclusions of his own book, declaring that he had come to the point where he was skeptical of all naturalistic theories of origins. Due to the immense molecular complexity of the cell and the information bearing properties of DNA, Kenyon now believed that the best evidence pointed toward a designer of life.

In fact he was being released from teacher in the university for not going with the norm, of believing in evolution. One should really consider the credibility of today’s scientific information. Are they truthfully told or are they just merely theories with no credible foundation at all. Is Darwinism a fact or a myth? Could it be that many scientists had already rejected evolution but due to the fear of persecution amount the science community, they had decided to keep quiet about it?

Check out this link: http://www.leaderu.com/real/ri9401/scopes.html

Is this what science is all about? Suppressing the information because it doesn’t go with the popular belief of evolution?

Having said so much I came to a conclusion that science done right, point towards an Intelligent Designer. Darwinism is a myth, with no credible evidence just plain theories. In fact I observed that it’s not the lack of evidence that prevented people from believing, but it’s really this:

First, I observed that due to some mistakes that some people who claim themselves to be Christians, causes many of them to hated God and refuse to admit Him. To these people, I could only offer an apology for what my brother or sister had done that have hurt them. I asked that they will be willing to forgive whatever wrongs the Christians in the past may had done to you. It’s not worth it to harbors the hurt all the rest of your lives. Just let it go. Forgive that person. Jesus is worth everything to us.

Secondly, I observed that people cannot believe that in this great and vast universe, God would actually take notice of us. In fact one study actually shows that most of history’s most famous atheists – including Bertrand Russel, John Paul Sartre, Fredrich Nietzsche, Albert Camus, Sigmund Freud, Madalyn Murray O’ hair, and Karl Max – had a strain relationship with their father or their father died early or abandoned them at a young age, thus creating difficulty in believing in a heavenly Father.

Thirdly, the pride of the human heart. The desire to be in control and not by a supreme being. The refusal to admit that he is weak and need helps. It’s extremely hard for a person to admit that after years of research and study, he had actually been wrong in his opinions. If a scientist can actually admit his mistakes, that will be very courageous of him. I have find people who refuse to admit that they are wrong, or that to admit that they don’t know and have no answer for the questions that I‘ve post. So I sincerely hope that non of you fall into this pride category.

To end this I would leave you guys to read the words of Michael Denton’s and Bertrand Russel:

“No other theory or concept ever imagined by man can equal in boldness and audacity this great claim… that all starry heavens, that every species of life, that every characteristics of reality exists [to create a livable habitat] for mankind… But most remarkably, giving its audacity, it is a claim which is very far from discredited prescientific myth. In fact no observation has ever laid the presumption to rest. And today, four centuries after the scientific revolution, the doctrine is again reemerging. In these last decades of the twentieth century, its credibility is being enhanced by discoveries in several branches of fundamental science.” (Michael Denton’s Natural Destiny.)

“Why should a bunch of atoms have a thinking ability? Why should I, even as I write now, be able to reflect on what I am doing and why should you, even as you read now, be able to ponder my points, agreeing or disagreeing, with pleasure or pain, deciding to refute me or deciding that I am just not worth the effort? No one, certainly not the Darwinian as such, seems to have any answer to this…. The point is that they are no scientific answer.” (Michael Ruse, Darwinian Philosopher, in Can a Darwinian Be a Christian?)

There are more, but I’m running lack of time and I do wish to know all of your points in this. Please do not feel that I’m against anybody here. I love all of you though I may not know each and everyone of you. I’ve use to be a believer of evolution until I came across a secular book about Dinosaurs. In it states that scientists believes this and that…having a theory in this and that…Although I was only about 9 years old, I understood the meaning of credibility, it was from then I rejected evolution and decided to seek a more solid foundation for the origin of life.

Books to refer:
Nature's Destiny By Michael Denton
Evolution: A Theory in Crisis By Michael Denton
Darwin's Black Box By Michael J. Behe
The Design Revolution: answering the Toughest Questions on Intelligent Design By William Dembski
Darwin on Trial By Phillip Johnson
Icons of Evolution By Jonathon Wells

kyo83

[Mai]

....

I have only five words for god: You're not taking me alive!!!!!!!!!!!

[Red]

dam, kyo. u basically summarised what i said(er, expounded)

well, i guess all it takes is tons of quotes before reality slams into our faces, and we finally realise that science ain't that big after all. We were all so blinded.

people with some form of intelligence will definitely not decide to obey everything the world says. Its time to make our own inferences and conclusions, you don't have to be an expert on this.

The evolution theory, has never been supported by any evidence, just assumption. nothing could be further from the truth.

as the saying goes, give a man a little science, it will take him away from god. give a man a lot of science, it will take him to god.



btw, einstein believed in God, his quote on science and religion, is strengthening the fact that science and religion goes together, NOT tear each other apart.

personality, beauty, our actions that we deem right or wrong, did not progress from a lesser life form, to a greater life form. nothing could have. but a suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuupppppppeeeeeeeeerrrrrrrrrr intelligent God made everything. Without illustrations, we would still be blinded.

"Whales and dolphins bear their young alive and breathe air, yet spend their entire lifetime in the sea. Presumably, in order for dolphins and whales to have evolved, they must have originated from a land mammal that returned to the water and changed into a sea creature. But dolphins and whales have so many remarkable features upon which their survival depends that they couldn't have evolved! It would be a lot like trying to change a bus into a submarine one part at a time, all the while it is traveling at 60 miles per hour."

“…the probability of life originating from accident is comparable to the unabridged dictionary resulting from an explosion in a printing shop�

"just imagine, a bunch of screws on a beach are blown about by the wind, crash together, and produce a watch. Yet a watch is far less complicated than a single cell. It is also like saying a sun dial corrodes over time to form a digital clock"

“The chance that higher forms have emerged in this way is comparable with the chance that a tornado sweeping through a junk yard might assemble a Boeing 747 from the materials therein�

The reason he made all of us, basically was to be a part of his loving family. If we live our life, not knowing where we are headed, then we can only find out when we die. but if we live our life with the truth in our hearts, then there is nothing we have to lose. think about that.

[Commander~Lightning~Spike]

If God exists u would not be here talking about him.